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IRC Archive / Freenode / #linux / 2010 / June / 11 / 17
wizard_
My guess is _many_.
miguel000
I do not run the script from inside the console
but it will be run for instance by udev
theadmin
miguel000: hm... well, you can ask it to open xterm I guess but... how to wait input?
xeon-enouf
flo`: are any others (google) also having an issue with that make/model? which pm software do you use?
miguel000
yeah, I know how to get user input, just wonder how to get a console pop up
wizard_
I read that removing HAL from Ubuntu is safe now. Anyone have a link to more info on that? I cant seem to find anything confirming or rejecting the claim. I read it on the Arch forums.
Psi-Jack
wizard_: If by maybe you mean ~10, possibly.
theadmin
wizard_: Many apps depend on HAL, without it you won't be able to run those
Psi-Jack
wizard_: err, if by _many_, etc.
flo`
xeon-enouf, others are having it. they weren't able to solve it. others with the same laptop never had them.
xeon-enouf
flo`: have you tried peerhaps tuxmobil.org and linux-laptops.net? flo` when booted regularly, what's cat /proc/cmdline ? .. erm.. maybe you should upgrade to squeeze -- Lenny is old now
wizard_
theadmin: peopel are saying that udev takes care of that now since Ubuntu is trying to purge HAL.
Psi-Jack
wizard_: udev and hal do two entirely different things.
go|dfish
they're probably talking about xorg-server 1.8
xeon-enouf
flo`: it might be in some of the acpi* pkgs, .. your newer kernels aren't going to do much if the PM software is old/flakey ... one sec though
ananke
wizard_: again, you're making a big leap in assumptions. you think that when 'company A' uses something, it must translate to 'everybody using something'. That's simply not the case. being present in a data center does not equal being present on workstation.
wizard_
Ubuntu went from HAL to udev for device management in 9.10
flo`
xeon-enouf, root=/dev/mapper/VolGroup00-lennyroot ro quiet
xeon-enouf
flo`: maybe you can get something from this; http://www.castalie.org/Linux/C610-ACPI.html (even though it's a dell, not ibm/lenovo) at the bottomish concerning standby/suspend -- are you using laptop-mode and acpid?
flo`
xeon-enouf, yes and yes
xeon-enouf
hrm .. ok flo` .. maybe remove quiet to see boot messages -- i don't think lenny or any debian adds 'quiet'
but maybe newer ones do - ubuntu does, not debian (or didn't in the past)
flo`
xeon-enouf, it does ;)
Psi-Jack
wizard_: Again. udev and hal do TWO entirely different things.
rethus
my gimp is english, what can i do to get it german?
JigSaw-2
hwinfo --usb | grep "Serial ID" | grep [0-9][A-Z] and hwinfo --usb | grep "Serial ID" | grep [A-Z][0-9] is same or different ?
wizard_
Psi-Jack: Ubuntu moved things from HAL to udev. I'm just parroting what I read on launchpad and the Ubuntu forums, and the Arch forums. I could be wrong.
Psi-Jack
rethus: Hack it's legs off? ;)
JigSaw-2
( the grep difference )
xeon-enouf
flo`: i wonder if your issue has to do with the possible way the dm-* modules are loading ..ugh
go|dfish
JigSaw-2: different...
rethus
Psi-Jack: har har har
go|dfish
JigSaw-2: and the [..] stuff should be quoted
wizard_
Free X.org Server 1.8.0 with udev to Replace HAL
Psi-Jack
wizard_: You _could_ be wrong about a great many things. Why don't you actually look up the differences of udev and hal now? ;)
go|dfish
grep '...'
wizard_
http://www.linux-magazine.com/Online/News/Free-X.org-Server-1.8.0-with-udev-to-Replace-HAL
JigSaw-2
go|dfish, will both of them gives the diff output ?
wizard_
Not wrong,.
go|dfish
JigSaw-2: they could
JigSaw-2
ok
xeon-enouf
flo`: you feel you really have a need to use lvm on a laptop? with one HDD? :-p
Psi-Jack
xeon-enouf: LVM is awesome.
flo`
xeon-enouf, yes, as i'm often juggling with distros. repartitioning sucks ;)
rethus
how can i switch gimp to german language ?
flo`
xeon-enouf, some other guys told me to use a up-to-date live cd. that will not have dm-*, right?
xeon-enouf
Psi-Jack: so is kvm .. just doesn't make much sense on 192MB ram :-P
Psi-Jack
xeon-enouf: But your statement about using lvm on a laptop with only one hard drive, means you know little to nothing about lvm's full qualities.
wizard_
rethus: In LINUX: in console mode, type LANGUAGE=en gimp or LANG=en gimp replacing en by fr, de, ... according to the language you want. Background: Using LANGUAGE=en sets an environment variable for the executed program gimp.
rethus
i have exactly try this. didn't work
xeon-enouf
flo`: sure, more recent LiveCDs (knoppix, sysresccd.org, fedora) will have most lvm/mdadm/etc modules already
Psi-Jack: no, it means you know nothing about partitioning, nor kvm
theadmin
LANG=ru vlc does not work ere :/
wizard_
rethus: export LANGUAGE=no_NO:$LANGUAGE
without no, use de
Psi-Jack
xeon-enouf: Okay. Grab your katana. We're gonna fight this out.
rethus
if i type env, i see my LANG
LANG=de_DE.UTF-8
wizard_
no is norwegian
http://ubuntuforums.org/showpost.php?p=5975499&postcount=3
rethus: if you use Ubuntu, the second link should work.
rethus
didnt work
yes, use kubuntu 10.04
but didn't work
may cause of missing language-pack?
wizard_
rethus: do you have Deutsch language installed?
Do you use German already?
on yoru PC?
rethus
i didn't found anything like that for gimp
jes, whole system is german
GNU\colossus
I'm looking for a free, technically cound web-CMS with a free template available that fits a store selling antiques - suggestions, anyone? :)
wizard_
GNU\colossus: Joomla? Druple? Wordpress?
All are easy
theadmin
GNU\colossus: CMSMS too
ch077179
I am looking for a good tv software under linux, I have a pinnacle PC TV pro adapter (I think it's a 350pro)
wizard_
ch077179: http://www.google.ca/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBcQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mythbuntu.org%2F&ei=dysSTIaHIoaKlweJwMHVBw&usg=AFQjCNEUFhJt0qQnPaD_LAIKS8mbELJssw&sig2=6oaav54zhSJTRdRRHBb6VQ
oops, I mean mythbuntu.org
ch077179
thx, do you think it works under fedora?
wizard_
Mythbuntu is UBUNTU.
xeon-enouf
there's very rarely a _good_ reason in the world to use lvm on 1 HDD (and flo` s case is one, perhaps), period -- just like there's not many good reasons to slice your / into many partitions in 95% of the cases. This is why i asked flo` - and still, that's not a good reason IMHO, but to each their own (a good reason would be to use it to learn how it works, to be used in other deployments, where it would help a ton setting quotas, and resizin
ch077179
I remember trying to get mythtv running under opensuse..
Psi-Jack
LOL
xeon-enouf: You've just proven how little you know about Linux, LVM, and partitioning practices.
xeon-enouf
ROFLMAO
ch077179
hm, I am actually looking for something to watch tv on my normal laptop, without changing the current os
GNU\colossus
xeon-enouf: I disagree. LVM snapshots alone are woth having everything except /boot under LVM's stern guard.
worth*
xeon-enouf
snapshots? what's wrong with tar.gz / ?
Dominian
I use LVM on everything
selckin
lvm does cow?
Dominian
xeon-enouf: snapshots are literally 'pictures' of the live running file system frozen in time.. and a lot faster than tar'ing an entire drive
GNU\colossus
xeon-enouf: that's really just asking for inconsistent data
xeon-enouf
Dominian: no it isn't faster
GNU\colossus: nno it isn't
Dominian
xeon-enouf: funny, it is for me.
xeon-enouf
you remount ro
Psi-Jack
xeon-enouf: Oh, yes it is, and it's also incremental.
GNU\colossus
xeon-enouf: he probably meant taking the snapshot, and that is faster.
xeon-enouf: yeah, and how many porcesses will cope OK with the suddenly unwritable filesytem?
xeon-enouf
Psi-Jack: everytime i tar/gz / it's incremental
what?
Psi-Jack
(Action) laughs.
GNU\colossus
most programs aren't that fault-tolerant
xeon-enouf
unwriteable?
Psi-Jack
xeon-enouf: Got your katana ready yet?
xeon-enouf
(Action) falls off chair
Dominian
er..
incremental tar?
xeon-enouf
o m f g
Dominian
xeon-enouf: Instead of coming back with the unintelligble "o m f g" take the time to explain your stance.
xeon-enouf
you people make things so complicated, no wonder the world is falling apart
Dominian
xeon-enouf: Don't assume people know what you mean.
xeon-enouf
but you do..
Dominian
xeon-enouf: and talking down to other users of the channel won't be allowed either so please keep that in mind.
xeon-enouf
you already told me how i was wrong; ergo, you know
Dominian
xeon-enouf: I didn't say you were wrong
xeon-enouf
talking down? to whom?
Dominian
I gave a different opinion.
xeon-enouf
nobody's talking to you
Dominian
xeon-enouf: its a public channel.
I can comment on what I like.
xeon-enouf
...
Dominian
...
theadmin
...
GNU\colossus
use &
it saves a byte
oh
it actually doesn't in UTF-8
still, use it, because I command you to
phretor
I am having troubles freeing the (possibly locked) resources allocated by a dead process. Where should I start from?
GNU\colossus
phretor: what kind of resources?
rahsputin
hi. i am trying to create my own module for: 057c:62ff AVM GmbH WLAN USB v1.1 using the linux-package from the AVM website. my kernel version is: 2.6.31-22-generic and i have linux-header-'uname -r' and so forth installed.... since i havent found "ANY" howto on how to build it myself, you are my last resort
phretor
GNU\colossus I am not sure which one exactly, but I am sure that it's a resource allocation problem, because the same executable uses to take 1 second to load, and it got worst over time. Now it takes more than one minute.
GNU\colossus: looking at htop, it 70% of cache is still allocated although the machine is literally doing nothing.
xeon-enouf
phretor: *might* want to consider echo 2 > /proc/sys/vm/drop_caches (man proc)
(one thing i'm not clear about yet, is whether an -n makes a (usable, or otherwise intrinsic) difference there or not)
(for all such echoing values into /proc/*)
phretor
how could I check whether a user has locks on certain files/resources?
xeon-enouf
phretor: when you say dead, do you mean in D state? owned via init? or just a zombie?
phretor
xeon-enouf: it's not even in the process table
xeon-enouf
erm..
phretor
xeon-enouf: I mean, I don't see it if I ps aux it
xeon-enouf
phretor: i'd be conerned about being rooted then -- BUT -- perhaps i just misunderstand
or you might want to try and explain it better - more detail
Psi-Jack
Ummm
phretor
xeon-enouf: I suspect it's a resource problem for one specific reason. I am not an expert programmer, but I needed to modify the Firefox behavior in the following way.
Psi-Jack
Locked files/resources are not processes.
They would NOT show up in ps.
phretor
xeon-enouf: I need to launch Firefox by command line, wait for the page fully rendered, and then kill Firefox. To this end, I inserted an exit(0) in the latest function that gets called, which indicates that the page is fully loaded.
xeon-enouf
how do you kill it?
phretor
xeon-enouf: I am afraid that a exit(0)-ing without first de-allocating all the resources might cause problems.
xeon-enouf: the exit(0) kills it. I mean, I modified the source code.
JigSaw-2
Is it possible to start a program, which can not be get killed by any command ?
Psi-Jack
JigSaw-2: No
That would literally be completely stupid.
phretor
xeon-enouf: I know that I might have confused you. I apologize :)
koala_man
sure you can. just plug in a usb disk, let something use it, then rip it out and the process will probably get stuck in state D
Dominian
That's almost like saying "Hey, can I have brakes on my car that don't work"
JigSaw-2
or other way around, Can we start the program which will get executed on it's own, as soon as it get killed ?
koala_man
JigSaw-2: no, but you can have a second program restart it as soon as it's killed
Psi-Jack
JigSaw-2: Can you make a watchdog for a process, sure.
Kinda what init does, and djb's... oh what was that piece of crap djb made?
JigSaw-2
Psi-Jack, I did not get it.
koala_man
djb made a lot of awesome stuff
JigSaw-2
(Action) googling for djb ...
Psi-Jack
koala_man: That daemon watchdog system he did.
koala_man
JigSaw-2: there are tools that will allow you to hide processes and make them unkillable. they're known as root kits
blip-
hi all, i'm making a set of files/dirs to exclude from my backups of /home. Do you think it's a good idea to exclude all dot directories ? I can see .mozilla and .thunderbird taking ages to backup with thousands of little files
rahsputin
here is some data i have collected to my topic on the AVM WLAN USB: fwlanusb.ko module http://pastebin.com/71i606CE
Psi-Jack
Ahh
daemontools
theadmin
blip-: All those dotfolders and files are configs
koala_man
blip-: that's where most app config is, so it would be weird to exclude them
theadmin
blip-: You probably need em
blip-
ye i know what they're for. i'm trying to decide whether it's worth backing them
JigSaw-2
koala_man, never mind, But does it mean that, the process will not be listed in ps ax and so no one is able to kill it. RIght ?
koala_man
JigSaw-2: pretty much
JigSaw-2
koala_man, ok. I am downloading the "root-kit". Thnx a lot.
koala_man
np
JigSaw-2: keep in mind that most of them also open back doors, even if they claim not to
JigSaw-2
koala_man, like what ?
But if I do this for local-machine then it is safe...I guess.
koala_man
maybe if you wish hard enough
JigSaw-2
koala_man, anyway, I think, It;s worth to give a chance.
blip-
wow I nearly issues rm -rf /etc/ while wanting to delete a backup copy of etc which I placed in ~/etc :D
*issued
wonder what would happen. i wont' try
JigSaw-2
blip-, try it and then yo uwill come to know
go|dfish
oh dear
Dominian
!2
doh
koala_man
JigSaw-2: ok. just remember that information in ##linux doesn't come with a guarantee, and that owning rootkits is illegal in some countries and installing it on other people's equipment is illegal in most
JigSaw-2
ohhh
blip-
JigSaw-2, computer went bang :(
JigSaw-2
koala_man, mine requirement is that, I want to run few command which is get enlisted in "ps ax". I want to either hide that, or make sure that even root can also not able to kill it.
but do not know. how to do that ?